I hate!

[Steve P]

Unmarked police cars!

I got done on the M 62 today for speeding 92mph (70 zone) he clocked me over 1/4 mile. I dont normally speed excessivly. Of course I had to sit in the car and listen to the usual rhetoric, Kiss his arse to get a way with a fixed penalty (3 points £60 fine).

I then had to sit and listen while he babled on about how wonderfull his unmarked car is.. so M62 Manchester to leeds watch out for a green V reg 406 with 2 red rear Fogs. Overtake at your peril.

My point is, yes I was speeding, The risk of causing an accident is increased. however if the car was marked, I and other road users would have slowed. thus reducing accident risk.

:mad:

[Guardian of Forever]

I agree. Unmarked police cars are stupid. They only reason they could justify using them for a traffic stop is to fill a quota, and that's not even justification.

[DartMuffin]

The speed limit is just that, a speed LIMIT. As far as I'm concerned, its not enforced enough, IMO if the limit is 50, you should get tickets for 50 in a 50. Unmarked cars exist to catch lawbreakers... you wouldn't complain about an undercover officer busting a drug ring, this is the same principle. Kudos to the police for ticketing another dangerous threat to society!

*the above post was NOT sarcasm... at all*

[TDawg]

I have to agree with Muffin. If I had my way, your car would transmit it's speed to 'checkstations' on every highway sign. You speed for an extended perior of time (there are some places where speeding in moderation is fine, say, passing a car doing 48 in a 50 zone, and you don't want to get rear ended by someone speeding :) ).

A limit is a limit. So what if the police are unmarked? You are still breaking the law.

Then again.... I can't remember how many times I've broken the law..... :)

[Mad-Dog-X]

2 things...

1, Wow, Dart made a serious post j/k

2, I agree with Dart on this one.

You shouldn't be speeding. The limits are there to stop accidents, breaking them will help to cause more accidents.

& speeding also indicates a lack of patience(sp). However the damned word is spelt.

[Guardian of Forever]

Limit or no limit, you have to agree that enforcement is more effective when you can tell there's someone watching. If you see a police car, you obey the limit. No problem. If you're caught by an unmarked car, not only did you previously have no incentive to slow down, but the cop that's busy chewing you out now has no chance to pull over all the other people speeding. As far as efficiency/effectiveness, using unmarked police cars to pull over speeding cars is about as stupid as you can get. It's almost like leaving a schoolroom full of children with someone watching them from a locked closet without telling the children there's anyone watching them and then expecting them to behave because they're being watched. It won't work. That's just common sense.

Dawg, your idea would be an invasion of privacy, and thus illegal in the USA...at least if it came into existence and I was in a position to fight it on those grounds, I would.

As far as I know, where I live it's illegal to use unmarked cars for speeding stops. I don't think it's legal for them to use cameras (take a picture of the offender, mail them a ticket), either, and I know speed traps (police car hiding out of view and then pulling someone over) are illegal. I believe police cars in Ohio must have at least parking lights on when parked and clocking passing cars as well.

As far as I'm concerned, that's just. IMO it would be an invasion of privacy otherwise. It's analogous to keeping a meth lab in your house. You're not supposed to do it, and we all know it's bad, but the police can't just barge into your house to see if you have one without fair warning and clear evidence that you do. IMO, getting pulled over by an unmarked car or speed trap or being caught by a radar camera is no different.

[TomRhikor]

As a fellow driver, I'm with GoF and Steve here....when I see a police car, I slow down to a reasonable speed (over here you can be 15 KM above before you get pulled over).....there are times when speeding is a necessity too....when passing someone mostly, also to avoid some idiot rear-ending you....I mean I've had to pass slow cars in 50km/h zones more than once, than whip back in to make a turn...I once had to go 75 in a 50 zone, out of necessity for passing on time...

I speed, everyone speeds...if you're going 20+ km/h over, then yes, you deserve what you get, but speeding within a reasonable limit is fine.....going 60 km/h in a 50 zone isn't going to hurt anyone....the same applies for all driving, you've got to be flexable....if you get to a red light you know is a really long one at 3 AM in the middle of nowhere, no other cars around, no traffic cams mounted on the lights, are you gonna wait? Hell no, I'd drive right on through it...

And about setting up speed traps, that should be illegal in many places....I personally think those cause more accidents than they prevent....I mean anytime I c ome across a speeding trap where the cop is out of view, you'll have everyone thats speeding, meaning everyone, lay on the brakes pretty hard to slow down so they wont get nailed....it's almost asking for a pileup doing that...someone not paying attention, even someone paying attention, might not be able to slow down on time to not rear end the guy infront who's laying on his brakes just to not get a ticket...

[DartMuffin]

Riker: it is obvious that everyone speeds, the point is that they shouldn't. Going through a red light in any case is a bad idea, just recently a pedestrian was killed in Corvallis for that very reason, it was 3 AM, she was wearing dark clothes, and the car blazed right through the red light because "nobody was around"
As far as speed traps CAUSING accidents, I'll bet the incidents of that are VERY rare, your idea is legitimate, but I bet it never actually happens...

GOF: the cops can do anyhting they want and get away with it... the camera thing isn't legal here either, but it still happens...

Dawg's idea isn't necessarily an invasion of privacy anyways, all the government would need to do is engineer some good excuse to take away our freedom and everyone would eat the idea right up (*cough* airport security).

When you speed, you are breaking the law. There's no reason to pass someone going 48 in a 50 mph zone... nobodys going to rear end you just because youre going slower than theyd like to (waits for someone to point out a time that happened to them).

The idea is that people don't like having to give up money. I'll bet from now on, or at least for a little while, Steve is gonna be a little more careful about his speed EVERYWHERE, and that's the idea. Speed limits are for everywhere, not just for where you can see cops or for where you know speed traps are.

The law doesn't exist to PROTECT anyone... this whole "war on drugs" thing should have convinced you all by now. Police are there to punish people who do things the government doesn't want them to do. Speeding is one of them. If you don't like it, move to Columbia, but if you want to live in this country, you should just obey our laws and stop whining that you lost a few dollars, just be thankful that you have yet to cause an accident and the death of several fellow human beings.

[Guardian of Forever]

Originally posted by DartMuffin
Dawg's idea isn't necessarily an invasion of privacy anyways, all the government would need to do is engineer some good excuse to take away our freedom and everyone would eat the idea right up (*cough* airport security).You're right, but that doesn't mean it's not still an invasion of privacy. Just a poorly justified one.nobodys going to rear end you just because youre going slower than theyd like to (waits for someone to point out a time that happened to them).Well, close. :)

One time on the way home, I was turning onto the highway on which I live...there was a large space between where my road was and an oncoming semi truck...probably half a mile at least. I turned, glanced in my mirror, and realized that this semi was travelling much faster than warranted, and not willing to slow down. The speed limit was 55 mph, and I quickly accelerated to 60...the semi wouldn't quit barrelling down on me. There was oncoming traffic in the other direction so he couldn't pass, so I just sped up (might have been stupid, but you look a 60,000 lb hunk of metal flying at you at 80 mph in the mirror and tell me you don't want to get away from it). I ended up cruising down a 55 mph highway at 75 mph with a semi about two inches from my bumper for two miles...then I had to turn off to get to my house. I gave the guy at least 1/4 mile warning...I tapped on the brakes several times and had my signal on, but he wouldn't back off...I ended up making the right angle turn at 30 mph. I must say I'm glad I have a short and fat car.

In addition, my dad did get rear ended trying to turn left into our house (coming the other direction) several years ago...he was stopped waiting for a clear spot to turn, and got rear ended by some idiot.

The moral of that story is, sometimes you have to go with traffic or get run over. If that means speeding, it does. I personally would rather risk a speeding ticket than risk losing my car/life or limb.

[TomRhikor]

When I was speaking about running a red light with no one around, I meant no one. Not blazing through the intersection at 70 km/h and doing a quick glance from 50+ m away to see if there is anyone, I'm talking stopping at the light, then looking around, and then going if there is no one....And speeding is a necessity at the time, simply for defensive driving purposes, also if you need to do something quick to make a turn or what not...

[Steve P]

Prevention is always better than after the action. Yes I shouldnt have been speeding, but my point is. I see plod and I slow down. Now not only has he got 1 hour of paperwork to do but so has the PC in my local station where I have to present my licence. A marked car would have the same affect without causing paperwork. Its so hipocritical. They talk about "ignoring" Grass smokers as its a drain on resources yet they will spend 100's of thousands to nick (not prevent) moterists, why? because its a revenue stream.

[Guardian of Forever]

Originally posted by Steve P
because its a revenue stream. Exactly. Some places around here are charging like $135 (I think) for speeding tickets now...yes, it's a deterrent, but I think that's a bit high...especially when Celina, Ohio's city council is in the midst of debating whether or not to raise parking fines from $1 to $10...

...isn't there something in the US Constitution about setting a reasonable bail?

[Mad-Dog-X]

The unmarked cars are there because of people like you, always speeding when no marked cars are around. If nobody speeded, there would be no need for them, or speed traps. Its there fault they're there. Its your fault.

I'm prolly going a lil bit extreme here by saying this. But your wasting their resources when they could be doing better things like catching actul criminals.

---

Also, the likely hood of accidents is increased when you speed, due to a possibility that you will loose control of your car/bike.

---

GoF. Why didn't u take down the guy's number plate & report to Police?? I know it prolly wouldn't of occured to u to take it down. But after u turned off, you could of tried to.

& my mum has been in a similar accident to your father. I think she was parking the car up by side of road when a car came speeding around a corner & smashed into the car. My dad also was in accident. He was driving a car, the car in front of him stopped or something, car behind him smashed into the car, & his car went into the car in front.

I can't remember them exact details, but its the gist of it.

---

oh yeah, YOUR NOT F***ING RACERS

---

oh yeah;

1) I know my spelling is bad
2) I don't drive
3) If I did, I would not speed

---

I think this thread should be moved to flame board. Cuz its sorta turnin' into a war between non-speeders & speeders.

[DartMuffin]

*points at Dragon*

someone promote this guy!!

You just said pratically everything I was just going to... good work :)

[Mad-Dog-X]

Originally posted by DartMuffin
*points at Dragon*

someone promote this guy!!

You just said pratically everything I was just going to... good work :)

YOU WHAT

*faints*

fs, I actully got praise from DartMuffin... omg...

*goes into coma*

at least let me sit down before u do that:).

Anywayz, I was thinking about that stuff this mornin', didn't have time to post before going out.

& I might ack like a prick sometimes, but I'm not stupid:). - don't ask me why I said that, I don't know.

[TomRhikor]

Originally posted by Mad-Dog-X
oh yeah, YOUR NOT F***ING RACERS


Oh yes, we are :)

As I said above, it's okay to speed within a reasonable limit....going (I did the conversions to metric) 150 km/h in a 100 zone is insane, yes....You really deserve a big fine when you're that much over...but going 120 in a 100 zone, or 60 in a 50 zone is all fine...those speeds wont really make any difference...as a matter of fact (and driving history) most highways in North America were designed for 120 km/h speeds (75 mph), and for some stupid reason way back when the US government decided to lower the speed limit to 100 (60), and as always us Canadians followed fuit and did the same thing....but, I think in a few years, in Ontario at least, they'll be upping the speed limit to 120, as thats what the highway was designed for anyway...now, people already go 120 on it with a 100 speed limit, I do the same, so you can count on people going at least 135-140 in a 120 zone....you can get away with up to 20 km over the limit, it rules :)

[DartMuffin]

no... its NOT okay to speed
its the speed LIMIT
wether you're going 1 over or 50 over, its just as illegal

IN FACT in most places the police TECHNICALLY have the authority to give you a speeding ticket at ANYTHING they deem to be an unsafe speed. I know someone who once got a ticket for going 29 in a 30.

It may be "fun", but it's unsafe, and it's illegal

[TomRhikor]

Muffin, don't bother trying to tell me how wrong it is until you've got a license...

You try driving around a city at Rush hour, or anytime of the day where there will be many cars on the road. Speeding is a necessity. If you go the limit, you'll not just have someone riding your *** the whole time, which is much more risky than speeding, but you'll have a very large line of annoyed and aggressive drivers behind you. No one is always doing the speed limit. Everyone speeds. And when everyone speeds, this means either you speed and go with the flow, or you have people cutting you off, riding your ***, all of that...

I don't care what you people without licenses say, cos us people with licenses know that when in traffic, you have you go with the flow. It's more dangerous not to. The flow is always speeding, thus you speed simply to keep a seady distance between you and the cars around you. Even the people in drivers ed, these are qualified people who make a living off teaching other people how to drive properly, say that when you're part of a traffic flow, you go with it. You go slower, you piss people off, you impede traffic, which is also illegal. The qualified people who make a living off this tell you to go with the flow, which means speed. If the traffic is going 60 in a 50 zone, you go 60.

[Silverlock]

I'll agree with TR here *sigh*

Not speeding is just idiotic in some cases.

[TomRhikor]

Now you know when me and Slock agree on something, one of two things is correct:

1. The universe is going to blow up.

2. We're right.

You just don't get it...I'm not saying speeding as in going 150 in a 100 zone, that is downright stupid, I'm saying speeding within a reasonable limit...generaly 10-20% above the limit is reasonable. When you get your license, Muffin, go into some large city, over 100 000 people, and go the speed limit, in the hieght of Rush Hour....watch what happens. You could consider yourself lucky if you don't get rear-ended by going the limit. Speeding is a necessity at times, it's that simple.

[Guardian of Forever]

Originally posted by Mad-Dog-X
I'm prolly going a lil bit extreme here by saying this. But your wasting their resources when they could be doing better things like catching actul criminals.Exactly. They shouldn't be out hunting us down. That's why I said they shouldn't use unmarked cars...it decreases effectivness.GoF. Why didn't u take down the guy's number plate & report to Police?? I know it prolly wouldn't of occured to u to take it down. But after u turned off, you could of tried to.Ok, you obviously have no concept of 75-80 miles per hour. At that speed on a two-lane highway, You DON'T take your eyes off the road long enough to read a license plate in your mirror. If you do, you're dead. Besides, while he was behind me, he was too close to me and his plate was below my field of vision from my mirror. Once I turned off, to see the plate I would have had to slow down and stop, which would have taken time as I had just made the turn at 30 miles per hour. By the time I would have gotten stopped, I would have been too far from the road to be able to see his plates, and even if I wasn't, he was going fast enough, it would have taken enough time for me to get stopped, and he would have accelerated enough to get a 12 by 6 inch metal plate with 7 digits on it out of my view.

It's not as simple as just arbitrarily deciding to take down a license plate number.2) I don't driveI can tell. It's readily apparent that you don't know what you're talking about. No offense, but you really don't and it's terribly obvious.I think this thread should be moved to flame board. Cuz its sorta turnin' into a war between non-speeders & speeders.Actually, it's drivers versus people who have no idea what they're talking about if you want to be accurate...I'm sorry, but that's really what we have here.

Finally, Tom is exactly right. That's what they tell you in driver's ed. Going at a significantly different speed than even partially thick traffic is infinitely more dangerous than stretching the speed limit to keep up with them. If traffic is racing, you race. If traffic is crawling, you crawl. If there was a minimum speed set, you wouldn't refuse to go slower than the minimum in order to avoid breaking the minimum speed law if there was a traffic jam and everyone was going 10 mph, would you?

[TomRhikor]

That last paragraph of your's, my point exactly. You could not be more on the dot. When traffic is going fast, you go fast, there is no other option. You're much, MUCH safer going with the flow than you are going the limit in traffic that is going 20+ km/h over the limit...someone doesn't pay attention behind you, your day gets really bad, really quick. Better hope they have good insurance. Again, this is within reason. You general try not to go double the limit, though if you have to to avoid getting hit, do it....It's called defensive driving, people. Go out on the road, just try and trust the other drivers out there to not do something stupid. Watch how fast the damage to your car adds up.

[Steve P]

you try going down a motorway @ 65mph (limit 70) something is going to ram u up the arse. you have to go with the traffic flow. The police take into account the conditions. The guy who bollocked me said if the raod was quieter or I was not at a junction he probably wouldnt have bothered to stop me.

As for people who dont drive lecturing me..excuse me I drive 60000 miles a year, I have only ever had i accident (8 years ago, hit by another car) so I dont take your opinion too seriously, much in the same way as we currently have a minister for transport (in charge of roads etc) who cannot drive (and is a speccy twat!) and a home secrtetary in charge of police, public order etc, who is blind! literally! As I said if yoyu have the expierence then I value your opinion, even if I do not agree. If not then you are just another tree hugging cardigan wearing windbag.

Btw before people ream me out I have the graetest respect for people with disabilties and blind people. And I do speak from experience.

[Mad-Dog-X]

Originally posted by Steve P
tree hugging cardigan wearing windbag.

I don't wear cardigans, & I'm deffinately not tree hugger.

So what, I don't have experiance, but it does not mean that I don't know anything. My uncle is/was a Driving instructor. I think he still is, but I am not sure. & my dad ain't home atm, so I can't ask him atm.

---

And you are not Racers, you have not had the sufficient training to be a racer. Or wot ever it is called. You also need to take a version of the test which the police take aswell, or at least some test similar to it. The test would involve advanced handling of a car and/or bike.

[Guardian of Forever]

Originally posted by Mad-Dog-X
So what, I don't have experiance, but it does not mean that I don't know anything. My uncle is/was a Driving instructor. I think he still is, but I am not sure. & my dad ain't home atm, so I can't ask him atm.Ok, so having established that driver's ed doesn't give you as much learning as experience, add to that you don't drive, add to that the fact that you've never taken driver's ed, only known a driving instructor, and add to that the fact that you don't even know if they're a driving instructor anymore...tell me again how this means you know what you're talking about?

No offense, but you're not putting forth a good argument here.

And I know I'm not a racer. Most of the time I'm afraid to drive a car at 80 mph, let alone 200. :o

[Steve P]

Originally posted by Mad-Dog-X



---

And you are not Racers, you have not had the sufficient training to be a racer. Or wot ever it is called. You also need to take a version of the test which the police take aswell, or at least some test similar to it. The test would involve advanced handling of a car and/or bike.


A good driving instructor will tell you how to drive to pass the test whilst adhering to the highway code. Fine for passing your test but if you drive strictly "by the rules" you will soon end up in A&E.

BTW I have completed several ADSP's (Advanced driving skill programs) These include skid training, high speed control, regaing control at high speed. accident avoidance and as a bit of fun pursuit driving. This was conducted by ex police drivers and is bloody good fun! So I do have the training. This is paid for annually by my company as part of there HSE.

As far as bikes are concerned I used to race scooters, lambrettas to be exact so I am also well aware of PTW riders on the roads.

[DartMuffin]

good work Tom, you managed to take a perfectly legitimate, decent argument and turn it into a flame against me... I have my liscence and have driven in a large city

Im not saying that its PRATICAL to never speed... im just saying that its illegal and its wrong

Piracy is wrong, but you don't see me throwing away my backups and mp3s

get it?

[The Apostle of God]

Originally posted by fartpuffin

Piracy is wrong, but you don't see me throwing away my backups and mp3s

get it?

Dear fartpuffin,

Making a copy of something for backup purposes is legal.

Please buy a brain,

The Apostle of God

[Guardian of Forever]

Originally posted by DartMuffin
Im not saying that its PRATICAL to never speed... im just saying that its illegal and its wrongpoint 1: You just said it's illegal and wrong not to speed.

point 2: Illegal maybe, but given the choice of being run over/involved in a high speed collision or running about a 5% change (guesstimate) of getting a speeding ticket for $100-$150, I'm taking the chance on a ticket. I don't know about you...but I don't think that's wrong.

I also would rather pay all the money in the world than know I was responsible for killing someone in my car because I was an obsticle to traffic. You don't exactly think about that kind of thing until you start driving and something catastrophic almost happens when you're driving and someone you love is in the car...believe me, when it happens to you, you won't think the same way again. Of course, the times that that kind of thing has almost happened to me haven't involved me speeding (I'm much more careful when I have passengers because I couldn't stand to have been responsible for their deaths and still survive...I speed at times, but in moderation and again, when it's warranted and/or obviously safe [relatively clear, dry road, clear visibility, no obstructions/cars coming at intersections]), but it still gets you thinking.

With either example, I'm not going to believe that it's wrong to break the speed limit when the situation warrants it.

[DartMuffin]

Apostle: I think "backups" almost always implies illegal ones... who actually backs up games legitimatley??

GOF: Maybe it isn't wrong, but its just as illegal... this can go to a debate about how much authority the government has. Many people don't consider it wrong to use illegal drugs, however its still ILLEGAL and in my opinion anything that is illegal is also wrong...

[TomRhikor]

I told myself I wouldn't post again short of a flame, but I'll make this thread my exception.

Mad-Dog-X, all you're saying is that you might know the theroy behind it. Let me tell you a little secret, driving theroy is alot different than driving experience. You could get all the in-class stuff and theroy you want, but you really wont know what the hell you're doing until you get out on the road.

Now, I've nearly been in a few accidents while I was driving, and I was not speeding. This is one of the few times I was going at or under the speed limit. Would you like to know what saved me from the accidents? Defensive driving. Defensive driving, of course, being the nice way of saying speeding, for this situation. What exactly did I do to avoid the accidents? Well, I floored it. My flooring it caused me to speed. My speeding caused me to avoid 2 accidents, not cause them. The point is, speeding within reason and when necessary is going to save alot more accidents than it'll cause. Excessive speeding, obviously, will cause accidents, thats what almost caused those 2 accidents I had to floor it in order to avoid, but speeding within reason isn't going to hurt anyone.

[DartMuffin]

its not up to you to make that decision

the government has obviously worked this out and determined what the safe speed for us to drive is

thats like saying it would be justified for you to murder someone who you knew was going to kill their family... just because it saves more lifes or whatever isnt the case... its really irrelevant

Tell you what... drive the speed limit, and IF it causes you to get in an accident... sue the government... theres no reason you wouldn't win

[Mad-Dog-X]

I spoke with my dad on this subject. He agreed with me that speeding is stupid & idiotic. He has been driving for a long time. 20-30 years roughly. He also said, that when the driving instructors say "go with the flow", they mean go the max. driving speed, not above.

Drive to the conditions of the road. Another thing my dad said.

My uncle is a driving examiner btw.

---

I don't mind speeding, so long as it is on a race track, not a public road. And done by professional drivers

[Guardian of Forever]

Originally posted by DartMuffin
however its still ILLEGAL and in my opinion anything that is illegal is also wrong... Not very open-minded, are we? The law is there for a reason, but it's not infallible...it's illegal to have a butter knife in the back of your truck when it's parked at school in some town in Texas...some honor student got expelled for it...would you say that's wrong? Ever read any of those stupid laws websites? Like how in San Francisco you get a $500 fine for detonating a nuclear warhead in city limits...in fact, in Ohio, it's illegal to arrest anyone on a Sunday. Would you consider that wrong too?

And Dragon, I know that's not true, because my driving instructor specifically used the example "If you're getting on a busy freeway and everyone is going 80 [mph], then you go 80."

**is talking to two brick walls**

[Steve P]

Originally posted by The Apostle of God


Dear fartpuffin,

Making a copy of something for backup purposes is legal.

Please buy a brain,

The Apostle of God

ROFLMAO!:p

[TomRhikor]

*Shakes head*
Not only did my driving instructor tell me you should go with the flow, he made me...I was driving with him going 50, the speed limit, in rush hour. Right away he asked me what the hell I was doing, then said I'm in a flow, then told me to start speeding. This is speeding within reason. going 10-20% above the speed limit is not stupid.

And muffin, when the choice is between a serious accident that could cause injury, even death, or speeding, it IS up to me to make that decision when I'm behind the wheel. I'm not going the speed limit when it'll risk someone getting injured or killed, thats the last thing I'd ever do.

[DartMuffin]

gof & riker - I understand your points... I too would most likely speed in such a situation, but it wouldn't be right for me to do so... and speeding hardly falls under the "silly laws" category... I even forget what this argument was about anyways...

[Guardian of Forever]

Originally posted by DartMuffin
I too would most likely speed in such a situation, but it wouldn't be right for me to do so...I just don't see how you think it would be wrong to speed in that situation. IMO, it's right to speed to avoid killing yourself or someone else and wrong to kill yourself or someone else to avoid speeding.

[TomRhikor]

It's not just speeding, that goes for just about eevrything. If you have to do something illegal to avoid yourself or someone else being seriously injured or killed, you're doing the right thing. If I have the choice between breaking a law or letting someone die, I'll break the law. Even the courts view it the same way. If you kill someone in self defence, in a kill or be killed situation, you'll probably get off...if you break a law to save someones life, you'll almost always get off. Same with speeding....kill/be killed or speed, I'll speed, and I'll speed knowing I'm doing the right thing.

[DartMuffin]

but the MAJORITY of the time people speed, it is not a life or death situation... in fact even in instances you mentioned before the worst case scenario is getting rear ended, which is just a little damage to your car which the insurance will pay... Ill bet its QUITE rare that speeding has actually saved somebodys life

[Guardian of Forever]

Originally posted by DartMuffin
but the MAJORITY of the time people speed, it is not a life or death situation... in fact even in instances you mentioned before the worst case scenario is getting rear ended, which is just a little damage to your car which the insurance will pay... Ill bet its QUITE rare that speeding has actually saved somebodys life When you get rear ended, it will give you a jolt and affect your trajectory. That's not a big problem if you're going five miles per hour. At highway speeds, however, it could very easily cause enough of a jolt to send you out of your lane, into oncoming traffic, off the road, or into a skid...or a combination of those. It's much more likely if you get clipped, and it's very easy to get clipped when you get thick traffic full of morons that want to drive fast and you're forcing them to drive around you. You don't want to get clipped, turned sideways, and hit on your door (or anywhere for that matter) at 80 miles per hour. You would die, end of story.

And, once again, you'd be surprised how often it happens that you have to get the heck out of something. Imagine you're entering a freeway with a line of semi trucks travelling 75 mph right next to you and traffic behind them. If you slow down to wait for them to get past, you're rear ended as soon as you get behind them and the people following the trucks get to you. You have to accelerate enough to get ahead of them. Most cars can stop a lot faster than they can accelerate, and you can't count on other people to avoid you. You drive defensively, and the most defensive thing you can do is get out ahead of those trucks. You have the room on the entrance ramp to take the time to accelerate, so you accelerate on the ramp while you have the room instead of slow down, since it would take you longer to get the speed back up when you're on the highway than it did for you to slow down on the ramp. You can then brake if you're going faster than traffic once you get ahead of the trucks, since your brakes are going to be good enough to drop your speed by even 20 mph or more (you wouldn't need that much though) in plenty of time to avoid a collision, and since you're going at the approximately the same rate or faster than the rest of traffic, you won't get rear ended.

That's just plain logic. It's not a fun situation, but it's the best way to handle it. I should know...I live 20 miles from Interstate 75, which happens to be the direct route from the UP of Michigan to Miami, FL, and consequently, a very, very well travelled route for trucks and tourists. It sucks to get on and off...believe me.

Please, please, learn to argue things about which you know what you're talking...

[TomRhikor]

I could not agree more with GoF. I live 1 hour from the largest highway, and the largest section of that highway, in Canada. 16 Lanes. Now, if you go onto the 401 on a rush hour where the traffic isn't gridlocked (that alone beign a rare occurance), and where the traffic is going very fast, and you go the speed limit as opposed to going with the flow, you're lucky to get off the highway without majo damage to your car and injury. There is a reason why the drivers ed instructors tell you to litterly floor it when you get into the acceleration land of a highway. You want to get up to the speed of traffic, almost always 100+, as quickly as possible. The scenerio GoF mentioned witht he trucks, you're a complete retard if you wait for them to pass. I've been in a similar scenerio, what did I do? I just about floored it and got ahead of those few trucks, and that didn't leae me much space left in the acceleration lane, so I had to whip in there pretty quickly to avoid going onto an unpaved shoulder at 120+ speeds...Personally I do not want to experience going onto a gravel shoulder at 120+ speeds, the slightest twitch of the wheel and you'll either spin out or flip your car, depending on what you drive. Now, in that case I had to drive offensively in order to drive defensively...I know, it's a bit of a contradiction...I had to speed to get ahead of the truscks, then I had to cut in pretty close, just short of cutting the truck off, to avoid going onto the gravel. Even though doing that is a tad risky, it's still much more risky to go under the speed limit, wait for the trucks, then cut in after them, going far below the speed limit, then having to accelerate quicker than your car can to avoid getting rear-ended by the traffic behind you which is going at least double the speed you are. In driving you do not follow every rule. You use common sense. And if common sense tells you to either break a rule or risk killing someone, you break the rule every time.

[The Apostle of God]

Originally posted by Guardian of Forever
Please, please, learn to argue things about which you know what you're talking...

Hey, you can't just tell people to not talk.

[Guardian of Forever]

Originally posted by The Apostle of God
Hey, you can't just tell people to not talk. I didn't. I asked politely. :p

[TomRhikor]

Originally posted by The Apostle of God


Hey, you can't just tell people to not talk.

Yes, he can. Shut up. See how easy that was? :rolleyes:

[Steve P]

Latest installment of life on the roads.

yesterday I was driving up towards a set of traffic lights. as I got to about 30 meters the lights went to amber, I started to brake gently. As I looked in the mirror I suddenly I head a load screetching noise and all could see was a mirror full of truck radiator and clouds of rubber smoke. Daft twat wasnt concentrating!. So what did I do? did I follow the Highway code and continue to slow down thus stopping at the traffic light but with a shorter car and a case of whiplash at least.

No as TR Rightly said I floored the accelerater went through the light just after it went red and safly out the other side...no one hurt. Except that as I went through a ****ing Traffic light camera went off!

I stopped, took the trucks details as he drove past (johnny foriener from CZ). I called the Police who really couldnt give a ****. As there was no injury or damage therefore and the truck was from overseas there was nothing to be done. I asked that they log the call as part of a defence if I get sent a tickit..they refused stating that if I get a summons I should appeal then. Mor Hassle.

I should have listened to Dart and mad dog. Stopped and Got Flattened by the truck. At least I wouldnt have this aggro, I could taste wonderfull hospital food..and just think of the Compensation!

*drives off looking for his next accident*